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0:23

December 22 1917 Anna

0:23

Angelina was jostled awake by

0:29

the struggle happening beside

0:29

her. A man was standing over her

0:32

husband raining down blows with

0:32

a hatchet. The intruder noticed

0:36

Anna's eyes shoot wide, he

0:36

raised the hatchet into the air

0:40

while also leveling a pistol at

0:40

her. The sounds of her children

0:43

crying panic the attacker who

0:43

charged into their room and

0:47

attacked the adolescent boy

0:47

striking each of them across the

0:50

head. He rushed back through the

0:50

home and out through the kitchen

0:54

door, but she had entered by way

0:54

of chiseling out a panel from

0:58

the door with a railroad spike.

0:58

Though he suffered five or more

1:02

hatchet blows Mr. Angelina would

1:02

survive Was this the act of our

1:06

man from the train, and

1:06

unrelated personal or familial

1:10

grudge, a mafia Vendetta, or a

1:10

new serial killer, perhaps

1:15

inspired by previous killers

1:15

we've already covered in 1918

1:19

and 19, New Orleans and

1:19

surrounding areas would be the

1:23

scene of a string of brutal

1:23

attacks, most of which would

1:27

take place against Italian

1:27

grocers. Join us as we add

1:32

another entry into this our

1:32

Macabrepedia.

1:41

Hello, and welcome to

1:41

Macabrepedia a marriage of true

1:44

crime that truly bizarre we are

1:44

your hosts, Matthew and Marissa.

1:48

And today we continue our man

1:48

from the train series, although

1:51

we are about to wrap it up. And

1:51

today we are talking about the X

1:56

Men of New Orleans. It sounds like

1:59

yeah, we'll be

1:59

discussing some of the murders

2:01

that were occasionally

2:01

attributed to the man from the

2:04

train. And often not, but

2:04

sometimes they were some, I mean

2:09

attributed to not not

2:09

necessarily following. They're

2:13

not necessarily attached to him,

2:13

but some people do put them all

2:15

together because of the

2:15

timeframe and though some of

2:19

these attacks are nearly top to

2:19

bottom, similar to the man from

2:22

the train, we have home

2:22

invasions in the middle of the

2:24

night, often with a hatchet,

2:24

Axe, or instrument that had was

2:30

readily available at or near the

2:30

scene, valuables left out in the

2:35

open. That would have been

2:35

easily found if robbery was the

2:39

intent they were left untouched.

2:39

The entry, though not a method,

2:43

even ever, like attributed to

2:43

the man from the train involved

2:47

a piece of railroad debris. So

2:47

maybe those are the

2:51

similarities. But comparatively,

2:51

comparatively, these attacks are

2:57

far less lethal. It was very

2:57

rare for the man from the train

3:01

to leave anyone alive during his

3:01

attacks. Most of the attacks

3:04

happen here in densely populated

3:04

areas, and targeted primarily

3:10

Italians and or grocers. These

3:10

crimes are pretty well covered

3:14

by other sources. And you may

3:14

already kind of be familiar with

3:18

the story already, but that they

3:18

often pull from a book called

3:23

ready to hang seven famous New

3:23

Orleans murders by Robert talent

3:28

that was written in 1952. The

3:28

source that we are primarily

3:33

leaning on, at least most

3:33

heavily for this is a more

3:37

recent book called The X Men of

3:37

New Orleans a true story by

3:42

Miriam see Davis. Davis has

3:42

compiled a more complete body of

3:49

evidence and presents it in

3:49

something of a kind of like a

3:52

story form, linking the

3:52

newspaper articles and court

3:56

records into an interesting and

3:56

informative narrative. I think

4:00

with this source, we should

4:00

bring the spotlight onto pieces

4:04

of information that are often

4:04

left out of other tellings. So

4:09

it should be a little bit new to

4:09

some people. So let us delve

4:12

into some of these axe attacks.

4:12

Let's do it as well as some of

4:16

the backstories in some stage

4:16

dressing. In this week's entry,

4:22

the morning of May 23 1918

4:22

Andrew Majo wakes to the sound

4:29

of muffled groans coming through

4:29

the wall that separate his room

4:33

from the adjoining domicile of

4:33

his brother Joseph and Josephs

4:40

wife, Catherine majia. He

4:40

listened for a few moments. A

4:45

feeling of something being

4:45

terribly wrong began to fill

4:48

him. He rose from his bed

4:48

shaking off what he could from

4:51

the previous night's drink. He

4:51

gathered himself and staggered

4:55

down the hall to his brother's

4:55

door where he knocked the

4:59

terrible wall wordless groans

4:59

continued. He placed his hand on

5:03

the knob trying and failing to

5:03

pull taught the Frank threads of

5:06

his courage. His ears thudding

5:06

with the fear filled pounding of

5:10

his heart. He tried to Will his

5:10

hand to turn the knob but

5:13

couldn't find the courage. He

5:13

feared what he would see once

5:17

the door was open. So he fled

5:17

down the street to the home of

5:20

his other brother Jake Mazzeo.

5:20

Together the to return to the to

5:24

the door. By this time the moans

5:24

were very faint. Jake rapped on

5:28

the door, and when no response

5:28

was immediate, he entered, he

5:32

entered a hellish scene that

5:32

would be described in the papers

5:35

as a bloody slaughter pen. The

5:35

couple had been attacked in

5:40

their bed, Joseph was the source

5:40

of the moans. His throat had

5:43

been cut and his head split and

5:43

bludgeoned. He weakly gurgled

5:48

out his last few sputtering

5:48

breaths as his brother stood

5:52

over him. Catherine battered in

5:52

similar fashion had already

5:56

expired. The slash across her

5:56

throat nearly decapitated her.

6:00

Well, that'll do it.

6:00

What was his last words?

6:05

How far am I supposed

6:05

to literally just said, I said,

6:07

he gurgled on his last breaths.

6:09

I thought you said your

6:09

last words. Sorry, Miss heard.

6:12

Go ahead.

6:13

What were his last words?

6:14

I was like, well, you

6:14

Well, if I thought you said

6:17

words what's hot, but that

6:17

wasn't.

6:20

Joseph Mazzeo and

6:20

Catherine Mazzeo lay dead or

6:23

dying in their bedroom. Unlike

6:23

many of our previous crime

6:27

scenes, the bodies here are not

6:27

laying in the bed as if they had

6:31

never had a chance to wake up.

6:31

These two clearly arrived about

6:36

in a panic trying to hold their

6:36

gushing wounds shut. Catherine's

6:40

throat cut so deep that she

6:40

would have likely blood out in

6:43

minutes, if not seconds,

6:43

excruciatingly long minutes,

6:49

gripped in terror of knowing

6:49

that she was about to die. It

6:52

may have been an unintentional

6:52

mercy for the attack to strike

6:57

her in the head and possibly

6:57

days her enough to allow her to

7:00

not understand what had

7:00

transpired her last living

7:05

moments, Joseph not so quick to

7:05

die, he lays groaning in a pool

7:11

of his his and his wife's

7:11

mingling blood for upwards of

7:15

two hours before Andrew went for

7:15

help. Wow. Yeah, authorities

7:20

came to the scene to

7:20

investigate. The police and

7:23

coroner determined that the

7:23

throats were first slashed by a

7:26

straight late razor. Before

7:26

having their skulls bashed in.

7:30

Andrew, the brother that

7:32

lives then she wasn't

7:32

disoriented because she would

7:35

have had her well, she would have her throat cut and then bashed in the head. So

7:37

maybe after what I'm saying is

7:39

you get a throat cut hit in the

7:39

head, and it might have made it

7:41

so that was actually better than

7:41

just sitting there.

7:45

Well, I mean, I hope

7:45

she was disoriented enough to

7:48

where she had no idea what's going on. But yeah, I don't know.

7:50

So Andrew, is the

7:50

brother that lived in the

7:53

adjacent apartment. He quickly

7:53

became the prime suspect. Andrew

7:58

was a barber and had access. Can

7:58

you Todd? Sure. Except Sweeney,

8:04

Matthew. Andrew, he was a barber

8:04

he had access to the straight

8:09

razors like the ones that were

8:09

using the attacked. In fact,

8:13

some accounts claimed that the

8:13

razor blade found in the

8:16

neighbor's yard by investigators

8:16

at the scene. They say that that

8:22

the razor blade was actually

8:22

engraved with Andrew's initials

8:26

or his name, and employee of

8:26

Andrews would claim that Andrew

8:31

took the razors home from the

8:31

barber shop claiming that he was

8:35

going to get the blade repaired

8:35

and sharpened to the best of my

8:39

research. I can say that the

8:39

razor was found and it was

8:43

almost certainly the murder

8:43

weapon for sure. But it was also

8:48

almost certainly Andrews razor,

8:48

which is not a good start for

8:52

Andrew. This razor would have

8:52

been could have been picked up

8:57

in the house at some point as

8:57

this person was was doing the

9:00

attacks. So you know, but right

9:00

now not looking real good. The

9:05

attacker in this story and in

9:05

all of the man from the train

9:08

stories often use the tools that

9:08

he just had readily available

9:11

around the crime at the time. So

9:11

he found a straight razor he's

9:14

using a straight razor he finds

9:14

an axe, he's using an axe he

9:16

finds both, maybe he'll use

9:16

both. It is also noted and I

9:20

think we've noted it a couple

9:20

times and other entries. pretty

9:23

unusual to use multiple weapons

9:23

in an attack slicer throat and

9:28

then bash the skulls in some

9:28

would believe that the throat

9:33

was slashed. And then the heads

9:33

were bludgeoned in to try to or

9:38

not even bludgeoned and but

9:38

beaten with a with an axe to try

9:41

to make it harder to tell what

9:41

the murder weapon was. Which

9:46

also lends it to possibly being

9:46

Andrew. You look very confused.

9:52

I'm just wondering, it

9:52

would be fairly obvious I would

9:55

think that their throat was

9:55

slashed. You're trying to make

9:58

it look like it was a nap

10:00

It's like an axe wound

10:00

instead. Okay, but I mean, why

10:05

what? If you have both of them?

10:05

Why would you if you feel like

10:09

one is more damning than the

10:09

other, why would you use the

10:11

more damning weapon at all, if

10:11

you have another perfectly good

10:14

weapon, so I kind of play in

10:14

both sides of the of the of the

10:17

speculation, coin here. So even

10:17

if it was Andrew Andrews blade,

10:26

it may have just been taken at

10:26

the time of the murder and then

10:28

discarded during the escape.

10:28

Those investigating also wanted

10:32

to know how it was possible that

10:32

Andrew was able to sleep through

10:36

the sounds of an assault that

10:36

woke up to this groaning through

10:39

a wall. Andrew claims have been

10:39

passed out drunk after

10:44

celebrating or as may have been

10:44

more likely, in the case of

10:48

dreading joining the Navy. This

10:48

is often reported as

10:52

celebrating, but this is May of

10:52

1918. So this is towards this is

10:58

World War One. Yeah. World War

10:58

One won't end until November of

11:02

that year. So it is very

11:02

possible that he may have been

11:04

drafted. And if nothing else, it

11:04

is likely, if nothing else, he's

11:09

at least likely to know that

11:09

millions had already been

11:14

killed.

11:15

I would be very surprised if it was a celebration. That's what I'm

11:16

saying like

11:19

this. This does. I

11:19

mean, that was I don't know, I

11:22

don't know the guy. But like,

11:24

like, almost like a

11:24

whole generation of men was

11:26

murdered were killed. And it was

11:26

like crazy. Yeah.

11:29

So they were millions

11:29

of people had been debt. They're

11:32

dead, crippled or maimed in the

11:32

last four years this this war

11:36

has been going on at this point.

11:36

So he may have been drinking

11:40

like it was his last night on

11:40

Earth, and thusly got himself to

11:43

the point where he's just pissed

11:43

as drunk. If anyone has ever

11:47

been that level of drunk, it is

11:47

generally kind of like a series

11:50

of restless hours punctuated by

11:50

moments of suddenly waking up

11:54

and being or being nearly

11:54

comatose and going back and

11:57

forth. And you know, so it makes

11:57

sense, being restless that he

12:04

could have woken up at some

12:04

point and, and heard those.

12:07

Sure, yeah, you got

12:07

that extra factor planning.

12:09

Also, I'm thinking

12:09

these people are Sicilian, or at

12:16

least Italian. And if it has

12:16

been my personal experience that

12:22

Sicilians and Italians, they get

12:22

loud sometimes. So if you think

12:27

about a stereotypical kind of

12:27

Italian, you will probably think

12:31

of them as being kind of the

12:31

kind of loud and having a

12:35

forceful presence. That's seems

12:35

to be kind of a PC way of just

12:39

describing a passionate type of

12:39

people. Meaning that it stands

12:44

to reason that hearing sudden

12:44

bursts of activity in an

12:47

adjacent room occupied by

12:47

Sicilians might not warrant an

12:54

immediate cause of suspicion,

12:54

particularly if you're just like

12:57

drunk off your ass, you know, so

12:57

you might have been groggy heard

13:01

a commotion was like, Oh,

13:01

they're, they're arguing

13:05

whatever. Also full, full

13:05

disclosure. I am Sicilian. And

13:10

I'm, you know, like my great

13:10

grandparents. Yeah, my great

13:15

grandparents are off the boat

13:15

from Sicily at this time period.

13:19

So, the if I seem to be kind of

13:19

going a little free on some of

13:23

the Sicilian remarks, it's it's

13:23

Don't Don't ask me. Yeah. So

13:31

anyways, law enforcement agents

13:31

would would find a bloody

13:36

clothes of the murderer at the

13:36

apartment, as if he had changed

13:42

clothes into a clean set of

13:42

clothes before fleeing the

13:45

scene. The bloody razor was

13:45

found in a neighbor's yard,

13:49

which means he changed his

13:49

clothes picked up the razor took

13:52

it with him, but left his dirty

13:52

clothes. money and valuables

13:57

were also left handed that a lot

13:57

he had left. It was believed

14:03

that he had a spare set of

14:03

clothes. Because when you beat

14:07

somebody to death with, excuse

14:07

me, when you beat somebody to

14:10

death with an x, it causes

14:10

murder is messy. It makes a lot

14:16

it makes him splashes.

14:16

Strangely, they found the guy's

14:21

clothes and he changed into

14:21

other clothes. It does this this

14:26

kind of seems to imply that he's

14:26

the same size as at least one of

14:29

the magic shows. But I don't

14:29

know if he's just wearing he'll

14:32

fit ill fitted clothing and

14:32

running down the street or not.

14:35

Yes, easily given.

14:37

I'm just saying man

14:37

Andrew. My dude, I don't know.

14:41

This seems a little bit sketchy

14:41

because and then like if you're

14:44

gonna leave the bloody clothes

14:44

there. Why are you going to take

14:47

the razor with you? You know,

14:47

like, it seems like, I don't

14:50

know. Seems like it seems like

14:50

Andrews got some splainin to do.

14:53

The razor that was used to kill

14:53

the couple was found to belong

14:56

to Andrew so that's obviously

14:56

not good for him. he'd took a

15:00

long time to go get help. He

15:00

didn't see he didn't seem to

15:03

check into the room or anything.

15:03

So it could go either way on

15:07

that. But

15:11

yeah, he also just

15:11

might have been just, he might

15:14

have just heard it and known something's really bad and got scared. Yeah, it

15:17

was just too scared open the door. Yeah, that's kind of the way I wrote with the

15:18

story there. But, you know, I

15:22

don't know, it's just seems a

15:22

little sketch. Andrew magico

15:25

became the police chief's prime

15:25

suspect in the crime. Yet he was

15:30

released after investigators

15:30

were unable to gather enough

15:33

evidence to put against him. So

15:33

I don't know the details as to

15:39

why all the things that I just

15:39

listed were not able to stick.

15:44

But whatever. So from December

15:44

1917. Through October 1919, New

15:51

Orleans was facing a string of

15:51

violent assaults that seemed

15:54

particularly targeted towards

15:54

Italian grocers, which at this

15:59

time, are admittedly common

15:59

Italian grocers. In

16:05

1870s 80s 90s, there was a rapid

16:05

influx flux of Italians that

16:10

were primarily Sicilians that

16:10

were immigrating to the United

16:15

States, the southern portion of

16:15

Italy was in a time of was

16:20

particularly rough during this

16:20

time, gangs that led to gangs

16:26

that would basically be the

16:26

mafia effectively. And I will

16:30

touch on that a little bit in a

16:30

minute. But they they had

16:34

caused, they had caused enough

16:34

strife that a lot of people in

16:38

the southern portion of Italy

16:38

and Sicily being for those who

16:42

don't know, Sicily is a is the,

16:42

the island that the boot of

16:47

Italy looks like it's kicking.

16:47

And apparently, they were all

16:51

leaving for this. So they were,

16:51

they were leaving Sicily and

16:56

coming to the Southern,

16:56

particularly the southern areas

16:59

of the US, many of these people

16:59

went to this region so that they

17:03

could work at in cotton fields

17:03

and plantations, sugar fields.

17:08

Many of the recently freed

17:08

slaves had left the region

17:11

during the Reconstruction Era

17:11

after the American Civil War,

17:14

and this created this created a

17:14

cheap or in case of slaves free,

17:19

a cheap or free labor void

17:19

suddenly became an issue. And

17:26

the Sicilian immigrants filled

17:26

the void offering to work for

17:30

cents on the day, the Sicilians

17:30

became associated with cheap,

17:35

almost slave like labor, because

17:35

this type of laborer is a lowest

17:39

class of people. Well, then,

17:39

they become the lowest class of

17:44

people just adjacent to them

17:44

just by the jobs that were

17:47

willing to take. They were known

17:47

to be very frugal, and many

17:51

families over the years, were

17:51

able to save up enough money to

17:54

open up some kind of shop at

17:54

some point. Hence the grocer.

17:57

Exactly. Most often. These were

17:57

grocers, grocery stores. Now a

18:01

grocery store here. This is like

18:01

a little corner shop. This is

18:04

like the way that at least in

18:04

American cities, this is almost

18:08

like more convenience store ish,

18:08

which I feel is still kind of an

18:11

immigrant's. There's a lot of

18:11

immigrants who still kind of do

18:14

this, like, come to America and

18:14

make a corner store kind of a

18:17

thing, right? So seems to be a

18:17

nice, nice avenue for

18:22

advancement. So these Italian

18:22

grocery shops begin to open up

18:26

all around New Orleans.

18:26

Eventually, the majority of

18:31

grocers are Italian, like 50% of

18:31

all grocery stores are Italian

18:35

run grocery stores. Buy like the

18:35

1920s. So like I said, just in

18:40

New Orleans, yeah. So it stands

18:40

to reason that like the fact

18:45

that they happen to be Italian

18:45

grocers. They might just there's

18:50

just so many Italian grocers

18:50

there. If you if you if you have

18:53

you break into somebody's house,

18:53

it could be in Italian. And if

18:57

they are Italian, they're

18:57

probably a grocer. So maybe it's

19:00

not quite so targeted, but it's

19:00

pretty targeted. So why this

19:07

detour down history lane?

19:07

There's a few reasons. One is to

19:10

say that at this time. Like Like

19:10

I said, if you break into a

19:14

grocery store, where the owners

19:14

also live, there's a pretty high

19:18

likelihood that they're going to

19:18

be Sicilians. Also, there was a

19:22

very negative feeling towards

19:22

Italian immigrants, immigrants

19:26

in general, but particularly

19:26

Italian immigrants in October

19:30

1890,

19:31

which things never

19:31

change? Yeah. On that,

19:35

which I don't really

19:35

didn't cover in here on that.

19:38

Somebody unrelated to this, at

19:38

my work, had had told me this

19:46

anecdotal story about him and

19:46

his friend, arguing about

19:52

Italians particularly Sicilians

19:52

being white or not. And I was

19:58

like, what? Like, I'm I'd never

19:58

heard that before. And, and

20:03

apparently that is a that is a,

20:03

that was a common belief during

20:07

the timeframe that we're talking

20:07

about in the 1880s to 1920s,

20:12

whatever in the south, because

20:12

of the fact that they worked in

20:15

the fields and everything, and

20:15

they're darker, they we are

20:19

darker skinned, to kind of

20:19

people and whatnot if you have

20:21

that kind of a heritage, and

20:21

because they associated with all

20:24

these other immigrants,

20:24

particularly African Americans

20:27

and, and whatnot, it made it so

20:27

that they, they, they kind of

20:32

became like this not quite

20:32

white, white, which was really

20:36

weird. I'd never heard that

20:36

before. And then in doing the

20:39

research for this, I was like,

20:39

that's, that's still held on

20:44

like this. This is this is the

20:44

origins of that kind of belief

20:48

thing, which is weird, but

20:50

you're saying is we

20:50

have racism at play here, for

20:52

sure. Yeah.

20:53

And also, when I found

20:53

the, what was it the database of

20:57

racial slurs? I was like, wow,

20:57

everyone's racist all the time.

21:04

Hmm. I've been called so many of

21:04

these words, and I never really

21:07

took it as be as being like a

21:07

slur. But oh, yeah, whatever.

21:11

Anyway, that's fine. Anyway, so

21:11

going back a little bit before

21:15

the the axe murders and stuff.

21:15

October 8, October of 1890.

21:22

Police Chief David Hennessy was

21:22

shot and killed in the streets.

21:27

His last words, do know this

21:27

ones last words, were something

21:32

to the effect of the day goes

21:32

got me. This resulted in 11

21:38

Sicilian suspects being rounded

21:38

up for questioning. There was

21:42

not evidence enough to link

21:42

those who were detained to the

21:45

crime. And many of them were

21:45

acquitted. And they were

21:50

scheduled to be released. The

21:50

non Sicilians in the community

21:54

got wind of this and stormed the

21:54

building where they were being

21:59

held and lynched. At least six

21:59

of them. mobs are scary, man.

22:03

Yeah, mob mentality is not. So

22:03

this is why, like I referenced

22:06

so often and the other ones,

22:06

like people are sometimes

22:08

arrested for their own safety,

22:08

even when you're arrested. If

22:12

the mob is big enough, they're

22:12

gonna get you. Yeah. And they

22:15

came in there. And some some say

22:15

like, there was like, nine that

22:18

are, there was 11, total, nine

22:18

had been attacked, six of them

22:23

were lynched, and a few of them

22:23

had gotten away. But some of

22:27

these that were being that were

22:27

being lynched in this hadn't

22:31

even been on trial yet. They

22:31

hadn't even been like, yeah, the

22:38

mob mentality is scary, guys.

22:38

Like that's, that's not stuff.

22:41

So anyways, they were basically

22:41

just, they were guilt by race.

22:47

Their biggest crime was the fact

22:47

that they were Sicilian and

22:50

Sicilians were suddenly being

22:50

blamed for murdering a beloved

22:53

police chief. So for those who

22:53

are curious, speaking of racial

22:59

slurs, Daigo, Diego, that's

22:59

interesting. Diego is a Rachel

23:05

racial slur used on Italians and

23:05

Spanish immigrants who came to

23:09

work the sugar fields in postwar

23:09

Louisiana. Its roots come from a

23:14

combination of things. It could

23:14

be in because of the fact that

23:19

they were day laborers being

23:19

paid by the end of each day. So

23:24

they were paid as the day goes.

23:24

So that's as the day goes by. Or

23:31

because Diego was perceived as a

23:31

common name amongst them. It, it

23:39

seems that, based upon the names

23:39

that we're going to be throwing

23:42

around in this, it seems like

23:42

they should have been called

23:44

Josef's because there are a lot

23:44

of people that are being

23:48

attacked in here. And there's a

23:48

lot of them are Josephs that you

23:51

could pretty much just say that

23:51

if your name was Joseph, you

23:55

should have been watching out at

23:55

this time. Anyways, as the

23:58

Sicilian population grows,

23:58

there's a belief that the

24:01

establishing of Sicilian run

24:01

businesses and communities are

24:04

Italian run businesses and

24:04

communities that there are some

24:08

of the old country's traditions

24:08

are also being established. That

24:12

tradition being of the mafia, so

24:12

some scholars, and researchers

24:19

don't think that these crimes

24:19

are part of a single psychopath

24:24

or a group of racists but are

24:24

instead mafia hits and vendettas

24:29

that are being called in and

24:29

extortion attempts by something.

24:33

Sometimes it's the it's called

24:33

the Black Hand, sometimes it's

24:36

referenced as like a group, but

24:36

it's I think it's actually more

24:40

of like the the Black Hand is

24:40

the like blackmailing and

24:45

extortion. So it's actually not.

24:45

It's a behavior, not a not a,

24:50

not a movement. Right? It's not

24:50

a group of people. It's not a

24:54

gang. It's a it's a way of doing

24:54

things. So which one These all

25:00

kind of at this time, they may

25:00

not have been like organized

25:04

crime during during the era that

25:04

we're speaking it kind of

25:09

bloomed into it like there was

25:09

definitely obviously America is

25:12

very famous for their their, you

25:12

know, prohibition mafia crime

25:18

stuff that it has its roots here

25:18

but it might not have been like

25:21

as established as like a what

25:21

you think of like Chicago Al

25:24

Capone kind of Mafia stuff right?

25:26

You come to me on this

25:26

day of my daughter's wedding

25:31

oh yeah all right

25:31

Godfather reference we got a

25:33

movie so the the the assaults

25:33

that we just covered, there are

25:42

the murders even were the first

25:42

in a string of attacks on

25:46

Italians, or and or grocery

25:46

grocery owners. But it would not

25:51

be the first time that this area

25:51

would host a series of brutal

25:54

attacks on racial lines,

25:54

separate even from the crimes

25:58

associated with Clementine

25:58

barber net, which if you are

26:02

taking place in western

26:02

Louisiana, and we covered them

26:06

in Entry Number three, if you

26:06

want to go back to the entry.

26:09

Now that's what I call murder

26:09

volume three on our man from the

26:14

train series that there were

26:14

there was another series that

26:17

took place just across the river

26:17

in Gretna. Primarily, I think it

26:23

was Gretna Louisiana. These

26:23

attacks would later be known as

26:26

the cleaver attacks of 1910 and

26:26

19 through 1912. As the name

26:31

implies, most of these attacks

26:31

were the perpetrator. Most of

26:36

these attacks were done with a

26:36

cleaver and the perpetrator was

26:41

was actually identified as a

26:41

short, broad shouldered white

26:46

man who utilize the butcher's

26:46

Cleaver, a large heavy square

26:51

with the butcher's cleaver is a

26:51

large heavy square bladed

26:55

chopping knife used primarily

26:55

for separating joints of meat

27:00

and bones. So you know this, you

27:00

know what a butcher's cleaver

27:04

looks like. But the description

27:04

of the attacker is is important

27:08

here though, because almost

27:08

every time that he does get

27:11

seen, and even sometimes with

27:11

the the axe man, which is going

27:16

to be separated by six to eight

27:16

years depending it it is a

27:21

short, white, broad shouldered

27:21

man, which it falls in line with

27:28

Paul Muller. And in Valeska, the

27:28

belief that the person who was

27:34

swinging the axe had to be

27:34

short, but they thought that

27:37

Kelly was too small to be able

27:37

to he was too weak to do it. So

27:42

this Sam Aniol ways, but unlike

27:42

the man from the train, who

27:49

utilize weapons at hand, the

27:49

cleaver would separately break

27:54

into a butcher shop and steal

27:54

the weapon beforehand, often

27:58

blocks away from where he would

27:58

strike. This is a risky practice

28:02

as requires entry into two

28:02

separate locations in a span of

28:06

time where the first break in

28:06

could possibly be noticed while

28:10

you're doing the other crime.

28:10

Perhaps that was part of the

28:13

plan. If you break into one

28:13

place, yeah, and all the local

28:16

police force move over to there,

28:16

and they're gathered blocks away

28:19

and then you can do your other

28:19

crime. Who knows? So this is,

28:24

like I said, roughly about six

28:24

to eight years, depending on

28:27

what attacks you're going to

28:27

actually attribute to who this

28:31

was. Prior to the Angelenos

28:31

Harriet kruti would be startled

28:38

awake. During a home invasion.

28:38

Her husband, Auguste lay

28:43

sprawled alongside her. A series

28:43

of head wounds bleeding

28:48

profusely, the attacker grabbed

28:48

a hold of Miss kruti he

28:52

brandished a cleaver and

28:52

demanded money, Ms. kruti Mrs.

28:56

kruti produced $8 She had nearby

28:56

the attacker, though mostly

29:01

hidden in shadows was described

29:01

as a short, broad shouldered

29:04

white male. He briefly continued

29:04

to threaten Mrs. kruti before

29:08

leaving their residence slash

29:08

grocery store and he moved

29:13

through the kitchen stopped and

29:13

took the crude East caged

29:17

Mockingbird with him. Okay, he

29:17

exited onto the back stoop

29:23

through the door which he had

29:23

earlier pried a window panel out

29:27

of using a railroad spike.

29:27

Again, this is six this is six

29:32

years prior to the opening one

29:32

that I said that already has

29:36

some of these so this could be

29:36

the same guy. He tossed the the

29:42

bloody cleaver and retrieved his

29:42

shoes he had removed before

29:46

entering the shoes in one hand

29:46

and the birdcage in the other.

29:49

The attacker walked down the

29:49

street and then sat down on

29:53

another stoop to put on his

29:53

shoes. He rolls and smokes a

29:56

cigarette, all with the ease

29:56

that belongs Due to the violence

30:01

that he had just bestowed upon

30:01

August cruelty minutes before he

30:04

opened the cage and freed the

30:04

bird before disappearing into

30:07

the night, so strange Yeah, like

30:07

a neighbor saw him walking down

30:12

the street after this. So

30:12

freeing the bird. Well, the part

30:16

of the section that I just

30:16

recounted comes from a witness

30:20

who saw him walking down the

30:20

street, the bird flew back home.

30:26

This is cruelty gathered her

30:26

children before heading down the

30:29

street banging on the doors of

30:29

neighbors. Within the hour,

30:32

police were on the scene in

30:32

August kruti was moved to

30:35

Charity Hospital against odds

30:35

Auguste would end up recovering

30:39

from his injuries. Some sources

30:39

report that he that the crude

30:43

has died in this attack, but he

30:43

did not. The family has a burial

30:48

plot that can be found on Find A

30:48

Grave where you can see that all

30:51

of the cooties lived decades

30:51

beyond. And they all rest

30:56

together under a single

30:56

headstone. The police would

30:59

recover the cleaver and discover

30:59

that it had been stolen from a

31:02

butcher shop a few blocks away

31:02

that same night, and that the

31:06

item that they used to pry the

31:06

panel off of the door was a

31:10

railroad spike. This is reported

31:10

as a railroad shoe pin. But

31:17

those are those are the things

31:17

that hold like the carts

31:22

together. And it goes in but it

31:22

like goes in and it's supposed

31:26

to lock it into place. I think

31:26

that's what it is. I can't find

31:29

something that actually shows

31:29

what the railroad shoe pin is.

31:33

But the ones that are referred

31:33

to as a pin are normally blunt

31:37

at the end, and I don't see them

31:37

using that for that. Plus, if

31:40

you've ever been walking around

31:40

on trail on railroads, it

31:44

finding railroad spikes, the

31:44

parts that actually hold the

31:47

stuff to the railroad ties are

31:47

there, they're everywhere. So

31:52

and they have a sharp edge that

31:52

looks like a chisel Can you

31:55

could probably use it to pry

31:55

sure I'm thinking that that's

31:58

probably what, what is actually

31:58

meant in there. But I don't

32:02

know. I'm imagining that it's

32:02

that it's a spike. The

32:06

interesting piece of here is

32:06

that the person was broad

32:11

shouldered and had the

32:11

silhouette, at least of what you

32:15

would expect PAUL MULLER or from

32:15

the train to have, and he's

32:19

using, whether it's a pin or a

32:19

tie or a spike, it doesn't

32:26

matter that something from the

32:26

railroad right. So he took

32:31

something from the train tracks

32:31

and went out to look for a

32:33

little b&e or a little b and e&m

32:33

Depending on how you want to

32:37

look at it. A month after the

32:37

kruti attacks, another Italian

32:42

grocer would be attacked. This

32:42

time, the attacker swiftly

32:47

attacked the sleeping couple. He

32:47

brought the meat cleaver down

32:51

multiple times on each of them

32:51

after delivering a bone

32:54

splitting chop across the cheek

32:54

of tati galana The attacker a

33:00

slice across her neck. He then

33:00

realized that he had not done a

33:04

sufficient enough attack on

33:04

toddies husband, Joseph Roseto.

33:08

He had suffered two blows to the

33:08

head Joseph managed to retrieve

33:13

the pistol from his nightstand.

33:13

The intruder, the intruder was

33:17

able to toss away the cleaver

33:17

and escape over the fence before

33:20

Roseto was able to aim the

33:20

pistol Adam injured and bloody,

33:25

he managed to fire off two

33:25

rounds into the night air

33:28

alerting the neighbors the

33:28

police would recover the weapon

33:31

as well as signs of the

33:31

perpetrator as being barefoot

33:36

when he entered the groceries

33:36

home. Nothing was taken or

33:39

stolen other than the cleaver

33:39

which had been taken from a

33:43

separate store a few miles away.

33:43

And the reason I keep pointing

33:48

out the Barefoot thing is that's

33:48

also interesting for again,

33:51

going all the way back to the

33:51

fours because there was a

33:54

barefoot person who had who had

33:54

taken off and grabbed a pair of

33:56

boots as he left and stuff like

33:56

that. Also, in this time, time

34:00

frame. These are hard soled

34:00

shoes. They didn't have like a

34:05

lot of rubber soled shoes or as

34:05

we call them, well as I call

34:09

them sneakers in the south

34:09

doesn't refer to his tennis

34:12

shoes, but sneakers for a

34:12

reason, right? Because you sneak

34:15

around in them. But you know, so

34:15

that's another interesting thing

34:18

that this guy has taken his tees

34:18

taken off his shoes to get in

34:21

there and creep around. So

34:21

interesting there. Tati, galana

34:24

and Joseph Roseto would both

34:24

survive this attack. That's

34:29

actually why that's how it well,

34:29

so that this is another attack

34:33

that is vicious. It's another

34:33

attempt with with this cleaver

34:37

to kill some people. Both of

34:37

them survived the attack as

34:41

well. Again, that's that's at

34:41

this timeframe. I mean, this is

34:46

we're looking at 1911 We went

34:46

back in a little bit. These are

34:51

these are far less deadly than

34:51

the man from the train would

34:54

normally be at this certainly

34:55

well because what he

34:55

had is he had a very specific

34:58

sort of Mo Yeah, okay. into at some point.

35:01

So, early in the hours

35:01

of morning June 27 1911. Mary

35:06

Davey wakes to find a man

35:06

rummaging through her dresser

35:11

alarm she begins to shake her

35:11

husband Joseph, Debbie. That's

35:15

another Joseph. She begins to

35:15

shake her husband Joseph Davey

35:19

who groans but does not stir.

35:19

The figure turns at the new

35:24

noises and smashes her across

35:24

the head with an object that he

35:27

was able to get a hand up

35:27

quickly. The blow rocker and she

35:31

would awaken in charity

35:31

hospital, fielding questions

35:34

from police. She and her unborn

35:34

child would survive the attack

35:38

but Joseph who many assumed

35:38

would die before he could be

35:41

brought to the hospital lay in a

35:41

separate room. His exposed brain

35:46

swelling and squeezing out of

35:46

the split skull, no one would

35:50

allow visitors to tell Mary her

35:50

husband's fate, possibly

35:54

empowered by his bright future

35:54

as a grocer, his young wife and

35:59

their firstborn child on the way

35:59

Joseph held on for nearly 24

36:03

hours. He would later die on

36:03

June 28, leaving marry a 16 year

36:08

old pregnant widow. God this is

36:08

sad, Joseph Davy was the first

36:14

of those who were attacked who

36:14

would die. Another Italian

36:19

family that ran a grocery store

36:19

would be murdered in 1912. This

36:24

time following none of the

36:24

characteristics that we've

36:27

become familiar with. During

36:27

this double homicide, a man

36:31

climbed through the window and

36:31

shot the couple multiple times

36:35

before escaping. This attacked

36:35

helped perpetuate the belief

36:38

that these crimes were linked to

36:38

a vendetta or a burgeoning

36:45

Sicilian Mafia at play. We are

36:45

not covering the story further,

36:49

because it is most likely and on

36:49

an isolated and unrelated

36:52

incident. mentioned you're only

36:52

because the victims were a time

36:55

grocers. And actually, this one,

36:55

I believe that the wife was hit

37:01

and killed by a stray shot. So

37:01

it definitely looked like it was

37:04

targeting the man. And it seems

37:04

like they came in through the

37:07

windows I pop up pop up. And she

37:07

took one of the bolts and and

37:11

died. So again, Italian grocers

37:11

doesn't follow any of the other

37:16

characteristics. So we're just

37:16

going to leave that one as is.

37:18

So from 1911 until the attack on

37:18

the Angelenos in 1917. There

37:26

would be a time of quiet. We can

37:26

only speculate as to why it may

37:31

have been because the cleaver

37:31

attack were just a series of

37:35

random home invasions with

37:35

similar emos. Perhaps if it was

37:40

just a single attacker, that

37:40

attacker went to prison or

37:43

hopped a train to commit crime

37:43

somewhere else in the country.

37:46

Maybe I don't know Kansas or

37:46

Iowa, after the Matthews, but

37:50

now we're back up to like

37:50

1970 1918 Louis Bessemer and his

37:55

girlfriend Harry lo often

37:55

reported as mistress sometimes

37:59

as his wife. She actually

37:59

claimed to be his wife

38:02

originally, but Bessemer would

38:02

deny it once he found out that

38:05

his actual wife was in town. They were attacked on the

38:09

morning of June 27 1918. So this

38:13

is almost like a year to the day

38:13

of the attack on the Davies or

38:17

I'm sorry, six years, six years

38:17

ago. Anyway, that that June 27

38:23

was when the Dow these were

38:23

attacks so it's like an

38:26

anniversary attack. Harriet Lowe

38:26

and Bessemer were discovered by

38:31

a bakery delivery man who

38:31

entered after No one came to the

38:35

door he found Bessemer staggered

38:35

bleeding but conscious a large

38:39

gas gash across the side of his

38:39

head, and his low was

38:43

unresponsive a trail of blood

38:43

leading from the puddle where

38:47

she lay through into an adjacent

38:47

room and porch area. Though

38:53

Bessemer was a grocer, he was

38:53

not Italian, neither was low

38:57

Bessemer was German low was

38:57

Irish. The two of them would be

39:02

brought to Charity Hospital,

39:02

where Bessemer would claim that

39:05

he was knocked out with the

39:05

first and only blow that he

39:08

sustained. Ms. Lowe, who was

39:08

struck multiple times initially

39:12

recounted that with her story

39:12

that she had, that she was, uh,

39:18

she was in the store when a

39:18

mulatto man came in, and while

39:22

she was closing up and asked for

39:22

tobacco, she claims that once

39:26

she told him that the store was

39:26

closed, he flew into a rage and

39:30

Strucker this story is clearly

39:30

false, as the blood in the room

39:34

was still wet when the delivery

39:34

man had entered, which if Mrs.

39:39

Lowe story was to be believed,

39:39

that would mean that the attack

39:43

would have taken place like 10

39:43

hours earlier. But if you tell

39:47

the authorities that there was a

39:47

marginalized person involved,

39:52

then someone with darker skin is

39:52

gonna get questioned at least.

39:55

Yeah, usually and that's what

39:55

happened. Bessemer had A black

40:00

employee by the name of Louis

40:00

Ober Khan, who worked at the

40:05

store from time to time and he

40:05

was of course questioned, and he

40:08

would later be released due to

40:08

lack of evidence while he was

40:11

being questioned. Police were

40:11

starting to to have some

40:17

questions about Bessemer who

40:17

often boasted about being a

40:20

worldly cultured polyglot, which

40:20

means he reads and writes and

40:25

speaks multiple languages. What

40:25

he was at, they were starting to

40:30

believe that he was actually a

40:30

German spy. Okay. When the

40:34

living space was searched,

40:34

investigators found letters

40:36

written in German, Russian and

40:36

Yiddish. It's unclear as to what

40:40

these letters actually contained

40:40

as accounts even differ as to

40:43

the languages that were being

40:43

that it was being written in.

40:47

Bessemer was arrested and

40:47

released a few days later, after

40:52

finding that he was less a spy

40:52

and more of a braggart in liar.

40:57

Bessemer attempted to visit Miss

40:57

Lowe in the hospital to deliver

41:00

her a package the police who

41:00

were still suspecting that

41:03

Bessemer may be a German spy are

41:03

up to no good did not allow him

41:08

to see Harry alo but did agree

41:08

to take her the package, which

41:12

contains a bathrobe, which the

41:12

police tore the lining out of in

41:15

search for hidden messages. Did

41:15

they find any? No. They also

41:20

staked out Bessemer shop and

41:20

house waiting to see if his

41:24

actual wife, who lived in

41:24

Cincinnati, Ohio and had

41:27

recently appeared in the area

41:27

would show up to confront him

41:31

about his affairs. I don't

41:31

believe she did. Ms. Lowe became

41:36

more more coherent and aware as

41:36

time passed. Eventually she

41:40

changed her story to be that

41:40

Bessemer was the one who had

41:43

attacked her. Really, yep, she

41:43

would provide enough evidence to

41:48

lead to his arrest. She would

41:48

eventually die of sepsis shortly

41:54

after a botched operation.

41:54

Bessemer would be acquitted,

41:58

nine months later. I think she

41:58

even went home to live with him.

42:02

While she was after she got out

42:02

of the hospital. I think she

42:04

went back to the hospital for

42:04

another surgery and she died

42:07

during that one. But yeah, so he

42:07

was he was eventually charged

42:13

with it. But again, got off at

42:13

some point. Now we're at August

42:17

10 1918. Pauline and Mary Bruno.

42:23

We don't talk about burnout.

42:26

If you look at my at my

42:26

my script here, it says this is

42:31

a pause for Marissa to

42:31

inevitably say we don't talk

42:34

about Bruno. Pauline and Mary

42:34

awakened to the sound of their

42:40

elderly uncle Joseph Romano, in

42:40

a struggle against an intruder.

42:44

When he when the ladies entered

42:44

the room, the intruder left out

42:48

of a window but not before

42:48

splitting Mr. Romano skull with

42:52

two gashes delivered by a

42:52

hatchet blade. The girls would

42:55

describe the dark skinned

42:55

heavily built man wearing a flop

42:58

hat and workers clothing Ramana

42:58

would be able to walk himself to

43:03

the ambulance when it arrived,

43:03

but would later succumbed to his

43:07

injuries while on the way to the

43:07

hospital. Now this account does

43:11

make the perpetrator they they a

43:11

dark skinned person. But this is

43:18

an that isn't a night attack.

43:18

It's hard to say for sure as to

43:21

whether or not it you know what

43:21

the what the skin color was at

43:26

that point. After the attack on

43:26

Romana with the town would begin

43:30

to buzz. With suspected X Men

43:30

sightings. It seemed that at

43:34

this time, people were catching

43:34

glimpses of shadowy axe wielding

43:37

figures lurking around every

43:37

corner. Also, at this time, a

43:41

retired detective named John

43:41

Dantonio would be the first to

43:45

publicly state that these

43:45

attacks may be linked to the

43:48

attacks of the cleaver that had

43:48

happened years earlier. He would

43:52

also say that he believed that

43:52

the culprit would be a normal

43:55

law abiding citizen most of the

43:55

time, and then suddenly switch

43:59

into a late night murderer, a

43:59

real Jekyll and Hyde kind of

44:02

character. That's his quote, not

44:02

not his deathbed. March 10 1919.

44:12

Charles quarter Miglia his wife

44:12

Rosie and their two year old

44:16

daughter were set upon in their

44:16

shared bed by an axe wielding

44:20

assailant. The adults were both

44:20

severely injured but alive.

44:24

Rosie slumped in the doorway

44:24

holding her infant daughter's

44:27

lifeless body. The intruder had

44:27

bashed her several times with

44:31

the X. Neighbors arrived on the

44:31

scene hearing the anguished

44:35

cries of Rosie and the commotion

44:35

caused by those who had arrived

44:38

to the scene already. 18 year

44:38

old Frank Giordano arrived

44:42

moments after his 69 year old

44:42

father, or Londo, Giordano blood

44:48

spatter covered the walls,

44:48

floors and ceilings rivulets

44:51

even ran down the painting of

44:51

the Virgin Mary that hung above

44:54

their bed. The room would be

44:54

described again as a slaughter

44:58

pen. Frank who had watched after

44:58

Mary was devastated along with

45:03

his father. The two families

45:03

were close neighbors who often

45:07

interacted pleasantly. There

45:07

were also something of business

45:11

rivals as they both owned

45:11

grocery stores the quarter make

45:15

Leo's would be brought to

45:15

Charity Hospital. Investigators

45:19

would find a back door panel had

45:19

been chiseled, free, and on the

45:25

porch rested a bloody X. Charles

45:25

would be released from the

45:30

hospital two days later, he was

45:30

uncertain as to the identity of

45:33

the order a description of the

45:33

of the attackers. Rosie while in

45:39

the hospital was being

45:39

questioned by the police

45:42

investigators the attending

45:42

doctor would note the

45:44

aggressiveness and kind of like

45:44

the leading nature of the

45:47

questioning, perhaps because

45:47

they were excited by Rosie

45:51

Quartermaine. Leo's ability to

45:51

identify her attackers or attack

45:56

attacker or attackers, as her

45:56

neighbors, the Giordano's Frank

46:01

in Orlando, her husband Charles

46:01

would deny these accusations

46:07

pointing out that Orlando was

46:07

arthritic 69 years old and in

46:12

failing health, it would be

46:12

unlikely that he would have the

46:15

ability to do any portion of

46:15

that crime also that Frank was

46:20

far too large to squeeze through

46:20

the hole last by removing the

46:24

door panel. She is eventually

46:24

released from the hospital and

46:29

is almost immediately brought to

46:29

the police headquarters where

46:34

she signs a an affidavit stating

46:34

that this is her, you know, this

46:40

is this is what happened. The

46:40

book that we're pulling this

46:45

from the truth, the one by

46:45

Miriam Davis has a kind of a

46:50

cool kind of recount as to the

46:50

way that the trial goes here,

46:56

but I'm not going to put it all

46:56

in here. Go get the book. It's a

46:58

cool book. It reads really well. Rosie's brought in she she signs

47:02

this affidavit. The police

47:05

arrested Giordano's, a trial was

47:05

held and though the evidence the

47:09

only real evidence against the

47:09

Giordano's is the testimony of

47:12

Mrs. Carter Miglia, which was

47:12

shaky and refuted by everyone

47:18

else except for her. Or Orlando

47:18

was sentenced to life in prison

47:24

while 18 year old Frank was

47:24

sentenced to hang. Later, Miss

47:28

quarter Miglia Mrs. Gordon

47:28

Miglia would change her story.

47:33

It seems that without the

47:33

constant coaching of the police,

47:37

that she would realize that her

47:37

that the story wasn't true. Like

47:45

she kind of like the pieces that

47:45

just didn't seem to make sense

47:47

to her anymore. So she and

47:47

others who witnessed her

47:51

testimonies would agree that

47:51

when the police were questioning

47:55

her, they would ask questions

47:55

like, why would the Giordano's

47:59

want to kill you? And was it

47:59

Frank that had the x or,

48:04

or Londo? Objection

48:04

leading?

48:07

Exactly. And even was

48:07

it? Was it the Giordano's that

48:12

did this to you or tell me what

48:12

Mr. Giordano did? So these are

48:16

all all these are the questions

48:16

posed by post before Mrs. Carter

48:22

Miglia ever even accused them so

48:22

this is like their normal

48:25

questions were just very, very

48:25

leading. Through interrogation

48:28

and investigations. The police

48:28

were seemingly manipulating the

48:32

traumatized woman to tell the

48:32

story that they wanted her to

48:35

piece together for them when

48:35

Mrs. Carter Miglia attempted to

48:39

recant her damning accusations

48:39

that were ultimately going to

48:42

put an old man in prison for the

48:42

rest of his life and kill his

48:45

son. She was threatened with

48:45

perjury charges being brought

48:48

against her that if she changed

48:48

her story and the Giordano's

48:52

received a retrial she would be

48:52

put on stand again, where she

48:56

would tell a different a

48:56

different account and thusly be

49:00

charged with perjury, and that

49:00

in doing so, if the Giordano's

49:05

if she recanted her, her

49:05

accusations the Giordano's go

49:09

free and she goes to jail. So

49:09

she's just switching places. She

49:12

says this, right. So, but she

49:12

took her she took her chances,

49:17

and she recanted her statement,

49:17

she said on her. Good on you,

49:22

when, when word of the retrial

49:22

reached the Giordano's. They

49:27

were obviously elated, but would

49:27

remain in prison for the better

49:31

part of the year due to a series

49:31

of postponements, rescheduling

49:36

and the prosecution not showing

49:36

up on the correct trial dates.

49:41

As far as the jailers were

49:41

concerned the Giordano's were

49:43

free men wrongfully imprisoned

49:43

and as a result, they were

49:46

allowed to come and go through

49:46

the prison as they pleased. They

49:50

had family gatherings in the

49:50

courtyard and Frank was even

49:54

given keys to the jail and

49:54

served in some capacity as part

49:57

of the staff. Like Oh, wow, you

49:57

guys, I mean, we have to kind of

50:02

keep here but whatever be back

50:02

by nightfall. Eventually a judge

50:06

would get so fed up with waiting

50:06

for this trial to go through

50:09

that he just he just throws it

50:09

out. He just throws it out. He

50:14

says, No, we're not this that

50:14

forget it. And in doing so the

50:17

Giordano's go free that also

50:17

allows for Mrs. Quarter Miglia

50:21

to avoid having to re testify.

50:21

So she avoids perjury charges as

50:25

well. So it all kinds of works

50:25

out. Right. I think it's very

50:28

shortly after they got released.

50:28

Orlando still ended up passing

50:32

away from the stress and living

50:32

in prison and stuff, you know,

50:37

so he did he did die shortly

50:37

after. I'm pretty sure he did

50:41

make it out. But he did die

50:41

fairly fairly. Shortly

50:43

thereafter, the quarter Miglia

50:43

and George Donald trial and the

50:47

proceedings that kept the

50:47

immigrant population of New

50:51

Orleans on high alert, these

50:51

families would begin to stay

50:54

together, the men often taking

50:54

turns to stay up on watch while

50:58

others had slept. It was around

50:58

this time that the police would

51:02

get a letter from the X man

51:02

himself. Well, they got a letter

51:06

from someone claiming to be the

51:06

X Men. It was more likely

51:10

someone who is trying to play a

51:10

prank the letter is addressed

51:14

from hell. Which Jack the

51:14

represents Yeah, it's a nod to

51:18

Jack the Ripper is no that was

51:18

found this this one is without a

51:22

kidney attached to it.

51:24

Part of the kidney but

51:24

yeah. I literally was just

51:28

reading about this sorry

51:29

for the episode. And

51:29

here's Marissa to read you in

51:34

her best master thespian accent

51:34

or maybe you can do some sort of

51:38

unintentionally offensive

51:38

accent. At the very least the

51:42

letter

51:42

Oh, I'm just gonna spring this on me. What is what am I reading? Let me see. Well,

51:44

since since you've thrown this

51:47

on me, I will do my best. But

51:50

you didn't know you're

51:50

supposed to do No, go ahead.

51:52

This is the letter.

51:52

Hell March 13 1919. A steamed

51:59

mortal. They have never called

51:59

me and they never will. They

52:03

have never seen me for I am

52:03

invisible, even as the ether

52:06

that surrounds your earth. I am

52:06

not a human being but a spirit

52:10

and a demon from the hottest

52:10

hill I am what your you are

52:14

linens and your foolish police

52:14

call the axe man. When I see

52:19

fit, I shall come and claim

52:19

other victims. I alone know whom

52:22

they shall be. I shall leave no

52:22

clue except my bloody axe, the

52:26

smeared with blood and brains of

52:26

he whom I have sent below to

52:30

keep me company. This is little

52:30

poetic. If you wish you may tell

52:34

the police to be careful not to

52:34

rile me. Of course I am a

52:37

reasonable spirit. I take no

52:37

offense at the way they have

52:40

conducted their investigations

52:40

in the past. In fact, they have

52:43

been so utterly stupid as to not

52:43

only amuse me, but his satanic

52:49

majesty Francis, Yosef, etc. But

52:49

tell them to beware let them not

52:55

try to discover what I am for it

52:55

were better that they were never

52:58

born than to incur the wrath of

52:58

the axe man. I don't think there

53:02

is any need of such a warning

53:02

for I feel sure the police will

53:06

always dodge me as they have in

53:06

the past. They are wise and

53:10

known know how to keep away from

53:10

all harm. This is long,

53:14

undoubtably you are lunians

53:14

Think of me as a most horrible

53:18

murderer. Wish I am. But I could

53:18

be worse if I wanted to. If I

53:23

wished I could pay a visit to

53:23

your city every night at will I

53:27

could slay 1000s of your best

53:27

citizens, for I am in close

53:30

relationship with the angel of

53:30

death. Not to be exact at 1215

53:36

earthly time on Newton next

53:36

Tuesday night, I am going to

53:40

pass over New Orleans. In my

53:40

infinite mercy I am going to

53:45

make a little proposition to you

53:45

people. Here it is. I am very

53:49

fond of jazz music. And I swear

53:49

by all the devils in the nether

53:53

regions that every person shall

53:53

be spared, in whose home a jazz

53:58

band is in full swing. At the

53:58

time I have just mentioned. If

54:03

everyone has a jazz band going

54:03

well then so much the better for

54:07

you people. One thing is certain

54:07

and that is that some of you

54:10

people who do not jazz it out on

54:10

that specific Tuesday night if

54:14

there be any, we'll get the axe

54:14

well as I am cold and crave the

54:18

warmth of my native Tartarus and

54:18

it is about time I leave my

54:23

earthly home I will cease my

54:23

discourse hoping that thou wilt

54:28

publish this that it may go well

54:28

with the I have been am and will

54:33

be the worst worst spirit that

54:33

ever existed either in fact or

54:38

realm of fantasy. The X man

54:42

Bravo and jazz out they

54:42

did the there

54:47

was no it was no

54:50

who will stat so the

54:50

letter unlikely real served to

54:57

inspire I would a wild night of

54:57

J As music and parties, there

55:02

was even music that was written

55:02

called the X Men. The X man's

55:08

jazz don't scare me, Papa. So

55:08

yeah, and there's there's

55:14

articles and stuff for that too.

55:14

But this is yeah, so this wild

55:17

party kicks off and nobody dies

55:17

that night.

55:21

Nice. Well.

55:23

The final attack that

55:23

is associated with the X man of

55:28

New Orleans was the attack on

55:28

Mike Pepitone, who was found

55:33

with his head split from an axe

55:33

blow. His wife entered the room

55:37

in time to see someone fleeing,

55:37

but was unable to make out

55:40

anything of note. Mrs. Pepitone

55:40

would eventually move to

55:43

California, where Mr. Pepitone

55:43

dies, would move to California

55:49

where years later she would

55:49

shoot and kill Joseph Mumphrey,

55:53

who another Joseph, who was a

55:53

man from New Orleans, and had

55:59

allegedly approached Mrs.

55:59

Pepitone on the street and made

56:02

threats and demands of money

56:02

stating to her, he would do the

56:06

same to her as he did to her

56:06

husband. This implies that

56:10

Joseph Mumphrey was the man who

56:10

killed Mr. Pepitone who was

56:15

killed in his bed while he slept

56:18

right? backs.

56:21

Sure, with the chop to

56:21

the face. Most most of the

56:25

talents of the X Men in New

56:25

Orleans attribute the killings

56:28

to Joseph to Joseph Mumphrey,

56:28

like all really, but I'm not

56:34

sure that the truth of this it's

56:34

nice to have closure and have a

56:39

person you say like this is the

56:39

person who did it. But it seems

56:42

odd that the X Men of New

56:42

Orleans would follow someone

56:45

across the country and then

56:45

threaten them on the street.

56:48

Also pretty convenient that Mrs.

56:48

Pepitone was the only person who

56:53

heard these threats or

56:53

implications of the murder.

56:56

No, I think it's far

56:56

more likely that somebody heard

56:58

that her husband was killed by

56:58

the axe man and then just kind

57:01

of play with that.

57:02

Yeah, I mean, or this

57:02

is a dude that he might have

57:05

done it, but I don't think he I

57:05

don't think he was the axe man.

57:07

You know, like, I mean, he might

57:07

have killed her husband with an

57:10

axe and but I mean like there's

57:10

so so many of these people who

57:14

are attacked by the X men

57:14

survived it's not like he's

57:18

getting loose ends taken care of

57:18

or anything like that. Right?

57:21

Then she guns him down in the

57:21

street and then appreciate his

57:25

industry street, but she guns

57:25

him down and then she never goes

57:28

to trial for it or anything. So

57:28

I guess I do believe there are.

57:33

Some think that these crimes

57:33

were all bungled robberies, or

57:37

mafia vendettas, some think that

57:37

they are linked to a Jekyll and

57:43

Hyde style psychopath. Some

57:43

length these attacks of the man

57:46

from the train? I don't think

57:46

any one of these would be the

57:50

single answer. But tell us what

57:50

you think. Not only on the X man

57:54

and cleaver of New Orleans, but

57:54

on all the murders we've covered

57:58

in the series, we were thinking

57:58

about doing kind of like this

58:00

wrap up episode separately when

58:00

we compile a list of all the

58:04

murder victims locations, et

58:04

cetera, et cetera, and then give

58:07

our final thoughts on the

58:07

series. But instead of doing

58:11

that as a show in, or an entry

58:11

in and of itself, we're going to

58:16

do that right here and Cue the

58:16

music. We don't have any music,

58:22

because I haven't done it yet,

58:22

for Marissa has McCobb minute do

58:28

to do this where you come in?

58:31

Yeah, it turns out,

58:31

making theme song is hard when

58:34

you're not musically inclined, but you know,

58:37

I am a great composer.

58:37

And

58:43

okay, so we I'm going

58:43

to touch on some of these

58:46

briefly. We only touched on

58:46

really a smattering of these

58:52

crimes, there are quite a few though.

58:54

There's tons of them

58:54

that we just didn't do just

58:57

because that's you know, that's

58:57

a quite quite a lot of crimes to

59:02

get through. That was what like

59:02

it's a between the two of the

59:07

things that this this, this

59:07

story of the of the man from the

59:12

train and of the New Orleans axe

59:12

murderer, or that would be just

59:20

an audio form from the books

59:20

would be like 30 hours. So that

59:25

would be as many episodes as we

59:25

have released for Macabrepedia

59:29

dedicated just to that, so yeah,

59:29

we just kind of pick or picking

59:32

and choosing through that.

59:34

So they do the author's

59:34

the man from the train do put

59:37

down 33 different elements, I

59:37

suppose for what they use in

59:43

order to try to say that this

59:43

crime or that crime was possibly

59:48

committed by the man from the

59:48

train. I don't. I probably won't

59:51

go through all of them. I'll

59:51

just touch on them. There is the

59:54

railroad track part of it where

59:54

the victim needs to be close to

59:59

railroad tracks. junction of two

59:59

roadways, obviously, you're

1:00:02

going to use the blunt side of

1:00:02

an axe for this and they're

1:00:06

going to take this axe from the

1:00:06

family is going to be outside

1:00:09

they'll leave it at the house

1:00:09

also. But I don't think any

1:00:12

that's out of the ordinary if you're going to use an axe worry, you know, why are you

1:00:13

gonna take it with you, you're not gonna take it with you.

1:00:16

Alright, so near train,

1:00:16

generally around cross where the

1:00:22

trail the tracks crossed, so

1:00:22

that you got multiple directions

1:00:27

that you could get out of there.

1:00:27

happening at night, generally,

1:00:31

generally, during a weekend.

1:00:31

Generally, on Sunday, yeah, an

1:00:38

attack using a weapon that is

1:00:38

readily available at the

1:00:41

location in which it takes

1:00:41

place. The covering of windows

1:00:48

and doors, yes. And the

1:00:48

bodies also

1:00:51

covering the bodies.

1:00:51

Generally attacks at night

1:00:56

between 12 and 3pm, or

1:00:56

something, or 3am, or something.

1:01:03

The lamp thing,

1:01:04

having a lamp with the

1:01:04

chimney removed, often there was

1:01:11

a fire. Often the bodies had

1:01:11

been posed.

1:01:14

Midnight or 2am is what

1:01:14

it was. But yes. And there was

1:01:17

also the thing about

1:01:17

prepubescent girls and some

1:01:20

evidence of masturbation near

1:01:20

them. But that didn't happen

1:01:23

with the many that we covered

1:01:23

ourselves. But that's one of the

1:01:26

things.

1:01:27

Yeah, they have, they

1:01:27

have 33 elements to the MO, that

1:01:31

they try to get as many of them

1:01:31

as possible per, per event in

1:01:36

order to associate it to the man

1:01:36

on the man from the train. But I

1:01:40

mean, they're also just very

1:01:40

coincidental, they're things

1:01:44

that would happen pretty much

1:01:44

regardless, if you if you attack

1:01:46

people at night, they're going

1:01:46

to be asleep. If you're gonna,

1:01:49

if you're gonna get a weapon

1:01:49

from the location, it's probably

1:01:52

going to be a knife or an ax.

1:01:52

Just it's got to be the most

1:01:55

convenient thing. Yeah. And

1:01:55

there's probably going to have

1:01:58

to be a whole family. You know,

1:01:58

there's, there's, the doors are

1:02:01

going to probably be locked

1:02:01

because it's at night. So

1:02:05

yeah, one notable thing

1:02:05

now is that the money and

1:02:07

valuables were not taken. That

1:02:07

is something that

1:02:09

yeah, which is interesting. And then if you can, if you take all of the

1:02:11

aspects to those 33 and the

1:02:17

author's from a man from the

1:02:17

train, they they do separate

1:02:23

out, likely, or like what they

1:02:23

would say like definitely,

1:02:28

possibly unlikely, and no way as

1:02:28

far as like, which which murders

1:02:35

or which, and the X Men of New

1:02:35

Orleans is a no way for them.

1:02:41

But if you take the MO and at

1:02:41

night, on a weekend, generally

1:02:48

in a warm, more warmer month, at

1:02:48

least a warmer climate because

1:02:52

Louisiana and during the

1:02:52

summers, like the entrance is

1:03:01

either a window or chiseling out

1:03:01

a door panel. That's a little he

1:03:05

doesn't do that anywhere else.

1:03:05

But this is also towards the end

1:03:07

too. So the end of his spree if

1:03:07

it was the same guy, but there's

1:03:13

just so many similarities that

1:03:13

happen on these other attacks

1:03:17

that are not our content,

1:03:17

generally considered to not be

1:03:21

connected, but they still hit a

1:03:21

good bit of those. A good bit of

1:03:25

those 33

1:03:26

kind of seems like a lot of these things are just the way life. Yeah, at the time. I

1:03:27

mean, if you're gonna, you're

1:03:32

gonna have a lamp, you gotta

1:03:32

have a lamp at the time. It was

1:03:36

I don't, I don't know, don't say anything weird about that, you're probably going to have an

1:03:38

x, it says something like 25 to

1:03:40

50% of households were heated

1:03:40

using wood burning stoves. So

1:03:46

those are the ones that are

1:03:46

targeted, obviously, you're

1:03:48

gonna have an x out there for

1:03:48

splitting wood. So anyway, we'll

1:03:53

all get into a few of these. The

1:03:53

list I have on here starts in

1:03:57

1900 goes through 1912 does not

1:03:57

include things like hinge or chi

1:04:02

Feck, or, you know, the default

1:04:02

or anything like that. Of

1:04:04

course, they don't put that

1:04:04

forward in there. Sure. But, you

1:04:07

know, in

1:04:08

what follows most of

1:04:08

the 33?

1:04:11

Yes, in 1900. There's

1:04:11

the van Lew family, there's only

1:04:15

two of them, which is not

1:04:15

common. Typically, it's more

1:04:19

than two. It's a whole family.

1:04:19

But that's a couple they're

1:04:22

killed in New Jersey. And about

1:04:22

200 miles later or 200 miles

1:04:26

away. A few months later, the

1:04:26

Allen family, three people die.

1:04:31

And so he's traveling all over.

1:04:31

This is why I'm putting this in

1:04:34

here. So next he goes to Florida

1:04:34

1300 miles later, the Kelly or

1:04:41

sometimes the Kaffee family in

1:04:41

1903. So this is actually pretty

1:04:45

spread out. These are.

1:04:47

The time and distance

1:04:47

are pretty huge.

1:04:50

Yeah, yeah. These I

1:04:50

think are maybe related, maybe

1:04:55

not but because there is a good

1:04:55

bit of spaced out ness to it.

1:04:59

And then later or you'll have

1:04:59

the hajus family in 1904. And so

1:05:03

it's the next one's only 100

1:05:03

miles away the Hughes family in

1:05:07

December of that year, so about

1:05:07

six months later. And then that

1:05:12

same month, the link is family

1:05:12

in Radford, Virginia so that we

1:05:15

went from Trenton, South

1:05:15

Carolina to Radford, Virginia.

1:05:18

That's about 300 miles and back

1:05:18

north. Yes. And then you got the

1:05:24

Boylan family the next year,

1:05:24

February 1905. There's three

1:05:28

there. They are in Arkansas.

1:05:31

Okay, so now moving far

1:05:31

west. 600

1:05:35

miles, yeah. And then

1:05:35

they then he goes to

1:05:37

Jacksonville, Florida. It's

1:05:37

about 700 miles, but it lives

1:05:40

again. Yep, September 1905. The

1:05:40

y's family five people. And the

1:05:46

next one is 300 miles away in

1:05:46

Cottonwood, Alabama, in 1906,

1:05:53

February, the Christmas family.

1:05:53

Another one of these is actually

1:05:57

killed on Christmas, but not

1:05:57

this one. So February 7 1906, to

1:06:01

Christmas family. They are

1:06:01

murdered in Cottonwood, Alabama.

1:06:05

And the next one's a really big

1:06:05

spatial jump because it's about

1:06:09

2000 miles away to Nova Scotia.

1:06:09

Oh, yeah. Yeah. But this is the

1:06:15

same year. So this is Nova

1:06:15

Scotia be in Canada. Yeah. This

1:06:19

is actually the same month. This

1:06:19

is the seventh February 7, and

1:06:23

then February 16. And it's 2000

1:06:23

miles away.

1:06:27

That's an endless.

1:06:27

Yeah. And it's a different

1:06:32

country. And it's very cold

1:06:35

in February. Yeah,

1:06:35

yeah. In Nova Scotia, yeah, then

1:06:40

I guess he got sick of that, because he went to Florida after that. So that's another 2000

1:06:42

miles away, it's like almost

1:06:46

2200 miles away. And in Florida,

1:06:46

it's the Ackerman family. So

1:06:50

there, that's the one with the

1:06:50

nine people, that's the most for

1:06:54

one single event. And that was

1:06:54

one family that was a parents

1:06:57

and their seven children, they

1:06:57

were all killed. Yeah, that's a

1:07:00

big one. So after that, he goes

1:07:00

back to North Carolina a little

1:07:05

bit farther north, 600 miles

1:07:05

away. And that is the liberty,

1:07:10

the Liri family. And that is in

1:07:10

July of 1906. So that's what

1:07:14

we've got there. But then the

1:07:14

next year 1907, there are no

1:07:17

events. And so the people from

1:07:17

the man from the train, the

1:07:21

author speculate that he was in

1:07:21

jail at this time. So he

1:07:24

wouldn't have been able to, of

1:07:24

course, if he's in jail, and

1:07:28

then it starts back though, in

1:07:28

March 1908. With the Hart

1:07:30

family, there's only two of them

1:07:30

there. So this is so this comes

1:07:33

in to where the man from the

1:07:33

train say that his MO starts to

1:07:37

change, because he was in jail

1:07:37

for a while perhaps that changed

1:07:39

who he was, in some regards, you

1:07:39

know, big events like that are

1:07:42

gonna change who you are, in

1:07:42

some ways. And so we stopped

1:07:46

doing things like, like

1:07:46

investigating beforehand and

1:07:51

doing a little bit of research

1:07:51

beforehand to see who he wants

1:07:54

to go after. So that changes a

1:07:54

little bit. And so that's why

1:07:58

they speculate that he a few of

1:07:58

these couples after this, were

1:08:01

accidental, because he thought

1:08:01

they were full families, but he

1:08:04

got them and they were just

1:08:04

couples. They murdered him

1:08:07

anyway. But that was what they

1:08:07

suspect. So his some of his

1:08:10

behavior does change. The the

1:08:10

buildings stopped getting burned

1:08:14

to the ground, stuff like that

1:08:14

they do change

1:08:17

well into the burning

1:08:17

thing. I mean, I think like the

1:08:20

idea of burning the place down

1:08:20

is to try to read any evidence

1:08:24

against you, right? I mean, any

1:08:24

any damning evidence that's

1:08:28

there, get, you know, burn all

1:08:28

the clues to ashes. But if

1:08:34

you're trying to hop a train,

1:08:34

and you don't know, pretty much

1:08:39

exactly when that thing is going

1:08:39

to be there, if you light a

1:08:41

house on fire, even in a rural

1:08:41

area, it's going to get

1:08:44

attention, and that's going to

1:08:44

draw the people to the location.

1:08:48

Yeah, so if you're trying to

1:08:48

beat feet over to a railroad,

1:08:54

that's only, you know, a quarter

1:08:54

mile from from where it is

1:08:57

burning, it shortens the amount

1:08:57

of time that you have to to

1:09:02

escape without notice. So I

1:09:02

think that burning the place

1:09:06

down is it's it was smart to

1:09:06

kind of change that also, when

1:09:11

so. And so when in 1908. Is

1:09:11

there a sudden bloom of rapid

1:09:17

succession attacks?

1:09:19

No, there are some in

1:09:19

1908 But no, actually they're

1:09:22

kind of spread out. There's only

1:09:22

three that year. There's one

1:09:26

part family there in Fraser,

1:09:26

Georgia, that was a couple and

1:09:30

they were killed. And then in

1:09:30

April, so the next month, it was

1:09:34

about 800 miles away. He went to

1:09:34

Watauga, Texas, and there he

1:09:39

killed three people of the girl family

1:09:42

800 miles away in one

1:09:42

month. I mean, it can be done

1:09:45

obviously. Nova Scotia thing was

1:09:45

like a week. Yeah, it can be

1:09:48

done by it's just this

1:09:48

zigzagging all over the place

1:09:52

thing. I mean, I guess you'd go

1:09:52

with more if we were assuming

1:09:56

that he has a job in lumber or

1:09:56

mining and he kind of goes to

1:10:02

seasonal locations and stuff.

1:10:02

And obviously, it doesn't appear

1:10:06

that he's going back to the same

1:10:06

company every time or something

1:10:10

because they're all over the

1:10:10

damn place. So it's just, it's

1:10:14

just I don't know, I, you may

1:10:14

proceed, I will wait till the

1:10:18

end. I think it's pretty clear.

1:10:18

But what I'm gonna say

1:10:23

there is a bit of a

1:10:23

ramp up later. And that that

1:10:25

changes also and I I'll touch on

1:10:25

a bit now, but they speculate

1:10:29

that earlier on these first few

1:10:29

years and all that he's he's

1:10:33

going there for work. So he's

1:10:33

going to be staying in this

1:10:35

community for at least a little

1:10:35

wild in order to see you know,

1:10:38

he'll help scope it out. But

1:10:38

he's there for work. So he

1:10:41

becomes not part of the

1:10:41

community. He's still a drifter.

1:10:45

He's in and out. But you know,

1:10:45

he still lives there for a

1:10:48

while. But then later on, it

1:10:48

seems like he doesn't stay as

1:10:52

quiet as long because a lot of

1:10:52

these are pretty much like we do

1:10:55

due to like a bunch of them. But

1:10:55

yeah, all of this is speculation

1:11:00

we should say but it's it's it's

1:11:00

possible. Woodland Mills,

1:11:05

Alabama, and that's about 700

1:11:05

miles away, and that's a

1:11:08

November, so that's from April

1:11:08

to November 800 miles and

1:11:13

so third or fourth time

1:11:13

we've been in Alabama,

1:11:16

yes, yes.

1:11:19

Texas and Alabama,

1:11:19

Southern, the southern most

1:11:22

southern states seem to begin

1:11:22

getting some love.

1:11:26

Well, it's just a second time for Alabama. But yeah, it's a lot of Texas to as

1:11:27

far as southern states, Florida,

1:11:33

Georgia, Alabama, Florida again,

1:11:33

Texas, Alabama, Alabama. So

1:11:41

anyway, next year 1909. This is

1:11:41

almost a full year. Again, this

1:11:45

is that second break. That seems

1:11:45

maybe he went back to jail.

1:11:48

Maybe we don't we don't know.

1:11:48

But almost a year because from

1:11:51

November 1908 to September 1909.

1:11:51

There are no events, but

1:11:57

September 21, the meadows family

1:11:57

are killed and Hurley and we did

1:12:01

do this one. And then of course

1:12:01

Begley with the hood family. And

1:12:07

that was a month later, Beck was

1:12:07

not that far as 80 miles away.

1:12:12

And then from there, he went to

1:12:12

Houston Heights, Texas. So

1:12:15

that's about 1200 miles away,

1:12:15

and that was in March. Okay, so

1:12:20

about five months, something

1:12:20

like that. And he gets the

1:12:23

Schultz family, there's five of

1:12:23

them. And from their

1:12:27

Marshalltown, Iowa, which is

1:12:27

about 1000 miles away. And that

1:12:33

is the Hardy family on June

1:12:33

5 1910. There are three of them.

1:12:39

First time in first

1:12:39

time in that that neck of the

1:12:42

woods, though this is where we're?

1:12:44

Well, yes. And maybe he

1:12:44

liked it because he came back.

1:12:47

And so then he goes to Johnson

1:12:47

County, Kansas about 300 miles

1:12:52

away, and that's in December.

1:12:52

That's six months is plenty of

1:12:56

time. The Bernhart family,

1:12:56

there's four of them, from there

1:12:58

to San Antonio, Texas, about 800

1:12:58

miles away. And that's in March.

1:13:03

So another four months, 433 ish

1:13:03

months, the castaway family,

1:13:07

there's five of them. And then

1:13:07

from there to art and wild

1:13:11

Oregon, and that's 2000 miles

1:13:11

away. So that's a good jump. And

1:13:16

that's from March to June. Yeah.

1:13:16

And that's the hill family.

1:13:21

There's four of them. From

1:13:21

there. He goes to Rainier,

1:13:23

Washington, not that far. It's

1:13:23

about 100 miles away. And that's

1:13:27

in July. So the next month and

1:13:27

that's the Coble family. And

1:13:29

there's two of them. It's

1:13:29

another couple and then to

1:13:32

Colorado Springs, which we did

1:13:32

touch on. That's the double

1:13:36

event. Yes. The double event.

1:13:36

Yes. And the Wayne and Barum

1:13:40

families on September 17 1911.

1:13:40

There were three each of them,

1:13:45

which made a

1:13:46

total of six people for

1:13:46

this two separate houses next

1:13:49

door to each other. Yes,

1:13:50

went to one and killed them all and then went to the next one and killed them all

1:13:51

right next door. And then from

1:13:54

there, he goes to Monmouth,

1:13:54

Illinois, about 900 miles away.

1:13:58

And that's still in September,

1:13:58

two months, two weeks later. So

1:14:01

September 17. And then 30th. The

1:14:01

30th. It's the Dawson family,

1:14:04

three of them. And then to

1:14:04

Ellsworth, Kansas about 500

1:14:08

miles away. And that's the

1:14:08

showman family on October

1:14:12

5 1911.

1:14:13

Yeah, this is where

1:14:13

this is where people were really

1:14:16

starting to be like these are

1:14:16

all connected at this point.

1:14:19

Because Because this little

1:14:19

cluster from Colorado Springs

1:14:22

all the way to Valeska are like

1:14:22

fairly rapid fire. Yes. And

1:14:27

fairly tightly clustered. And

1:14:27

these Yeah, these these I think

1:14:35

are all related. Almost

1:14:35

certainly, but it also could be

1:14:41

I don't I don't think good

1:14:41

whatever, it could be a murder.

1:14:45

Yeah, I will refrain to the end.

1:14:48

Yeah. So. So then to

1:14:48

payola, about 200 miles away

1:14:52

payola, Kansas and that is the

1:14:52

Hudson family. There are two of

1:14:56

them another couple. From there

1:14:56

to ballistic Yeah,

1:15:01

we started the whole

1:15:01

thing.

1:15:04

So it's not quite 200

1:15:04

miles away, but Valeska and

1:15:07

that's the more family and of

1:15:07

course we had the two visitors

1:15:09

also Lena. Yeah. That's

1:15:09

challengers. Yeah. So eight

1:15:13

there, accidentally, because

1:15:13

Lena and I know we're only

1:15:17

visiting, and then to Payson,

1:15:17

Illinois with the pan Schmidt

1:15:22

family as for them, but Valeska

1:15:22

is the big one. And part of why

1:15:28

Valeska was so big is because of

1:15:28

all these murders leading up to

1:15:31

it with all of the just media

1:15:31

coverage and scrutiny and

1:15:34

everything. Just

1:15:35

people were starting to

1:15:35

get it all together. Yeah,

1:15:38

that's being all linked. And

1:15:38

then also at the same time, this

1:15:41

is when the cleaver is hitting

1:15:41

New Orleans at this time, too.

1:15:44

So home invasions and murders

1:15:44

are on on a pretty steep rise in

1:15:52

1910 and 1912. Yes, it is. And

1:15:52

that those are the attacks that

1:16:03

are attributed to, at least from

1:16:03

the man on the train attributed

1:16:06

to a man from the train. In the

1:16:06

book, Paul Mueller, which got

1:16:13

his start, which we didn't

1:16:13

actually put in this lesson in

1:16:16

the 19, or 1898, when he was in

1:16:16

Massachusetts that started the

1:16:21

whole thing, before we hop this

1:16:21

first train to get the started.

1:16:25

Do we have an actual body count?

1:16:29

Somewhere between

1:16:29

somewhere around 125. But the

1:16:31

authors do point out that they

1:16:31

don't. They don't specify

1:16:34

really, most of them. They think

1:16:34

most of they, they think some of

1:16:40

them for sure were his, but they

1:16:40

don't go so far to say that all

1:16:43

125 ish were

1:16:45

I think that they

1:16:45

attributed 101 Murderers to him.

1:16:52

But then if you also include the

1:16:52

people who were killed by lynch

1:16:58

mobs, which happened in North

1:16:58

Carolina, and people who were

1:17:03

accused and ended up getting the

1:17:03

death penalty for for it, or

1:17:09

yes, all people were,

1:17:09

who were put to death for the

1:17:12

crimes. Yeah, that's

1:17:13

where that's where it

1:17:13

gets to the point of like, going

1:17:16

up to like, 120 or so. But it's

1:17:16

a good bet over over 100 people

1:17:22

may have been killed by this

1:17:22

one, one man. What do you think

1:17:27

after the series? This is the

1:17:27

Marisa No, it's to me, not your

1:17:33

listeners?

1:17:34

No. I mean, it was it

1:17:34

was interesting to go through

1:17:37

this. And honestly, to see the

1:17:37

patterns that was the most

1:17:41

interesting thing to me is to

1:17:41

see these patterns emerge. And

1:17:45

it's not just Paul Mueller, it's

1:17:45

the ones that almost certainly

1:17:49

weren't him. But they were still

1:17:49

so similar. And it's interesting

1:17:53

to see that.

1:17:54

So do you think there

1:17:54

was a man from the train that

1:17:56

was popping around doing all

1:17:56

these killings?

1:18:03

I think it's quite

1:18:03

possible. Yes. But I won't go so

1:18:07

far as to say definitely, I

1:18:07

don't know some of these are

1:18:12

hard to pin, I would say and

1:18:12

again, the patterns for every

1:18:16

ones, even the ones that weren't

1:18:16

necessarily even in the book and

1:18:21

things like that. These these

1:18:21

patterns emerged because a lot

1:18:24

of them were just the way of

1:18:24

life and so I don't know, it's

1:18:27

hard for me to say that the I

1:18:27

don't want to say this

1:18:31

necessarily. But the the things

1:18:31

they're using these 33 Like,

1:18:39

elements elements say that it

1:18:39

was a man from the train murder.

1:18:44

A lot of them are just things

1:18:44

that would have happened. I

1:18:47

don't feel like they're specific

1:18:47

enough to I don't know, I mean,

1:18:51

they're using them as 33 because

1:18:51

because they are you know, so

1:18:54

generic and understand that and

1:18:54

they they definitely understand

1:18:58

that also. But it was another It

1:18:58

was another world.

1:19:02

Yeah, I would say hell

1:19:02

no. And I had one guy doing all

1:19:07

this No, no, no, no, no. Every

1:19:07

every story that I'm not saying

1:19:14

that there wasn't like I said

1:19:14

from Colorado Springs to

1:19:17

Valeska. There are a lot of

1:19:17

connections that would make it

1:19:21

so those seem to be probably

1:19:21

connect those

1:19:24

seem likely connected

1:19:24

but certainly in Beckley seem to

1:19:27

be connected.

1:19:28

Also possible, but I

1:19:28

don't think that I don't think

1:19:31

Hurley and Valeska are connected

1:19:31

is what I'm saying. Like I think

1:19:36

I think there might be a you

1:19:36

know, a quick little spark of

1:19:41

murderers that that that kick

1:19:41

around for a little while. But I

1:19:45

do not think that they're the I

1:19:45

don't think there was a man on

1:19:49

the train that did this. I don't

1:19:49

think so at all. I don't think

1:19:52

PAUL MULLER did any of it. I

1:19:52

think maybe PAUL MULLER probably

1:19:54

killed the the first killings in

1:19:54

mass Jesus the name escapes me

1:20:01

as to who was with that. But I

1:20:01

know I don't think so. Because

1:20:05

this, like I said, the thing

1:20:05

that got me started on this

1:20:09

whole thing was that the divorce

1:20:09

followed. It was so similar to

1:20:14

the Valeska murders very soon,

1:20:14

but I was like, oh, hell, and

1:20:18

that and I was like, well, that

1:20:18

that meant that so then I found

1:20:20

the book and I'm like, well,

1:20:20

they're gonna connect them, they

1:20:22

don't connect them. They don't

1:20:22

have that connected at all. But

1:20:25

then if you also take the

1:20:25

deformers, where this is the

1:20:27

Barefoot thing and the home

1:20:27

invasion that way and all that

1:20:30

stuff. It also fits the AX man

1:20:30

from or the cleaver, at least

1:20:34

from New Orleans. Could that be

1:20:34

the same? You know what I mean?

1:20:38

Like, you can draw so many of

1:20:38

these connections between them,

1:20:42

but I really don't think they're

1:20:42

there. That's why I said, I

1:20:44

don't think so. I it's easy

1:20:46

to make these

1:20:46

connections. That may not be

1:20:49

there. I'm saying

1:20:50

I mean, at the end of

1:20:50

the day, we know was Ebenezer

1:20:54

pook, rampaging through the US.

1:20:54

But that will more than do it

1:21:00

for us this for this entry. I

1:21:00

know it was a bit longer than we

1:21:05

normally do. But we will kind of

1:21:05

just wanted to wrap it up a

1:21:08

little bit. And we would really

1:21:08

like to get your feedback. Like,

1:21:12

seriously, please give us some

1:21:12

feedback. Do you like the idea

1:21:16

of doing series? Do you? Do you

1:21:16

think it was the man from the

1:21:22

train was Paul Mueller? Do you

1:21:22

think it was somebody else? Do

1:21:25

you what are your opinions on

1:21:25

this particular series, both for

1:21:29

the content that we provided, as

1:21:29

well as, if you like the format,

1:21:36

what you would like to see in

1:21:36

the future, if we were to do

1:21:39

stuff like this, because we do

1:21:39

have aspirations, I do think

1:21:44

we'll be doing a series on the

1:21:44

Satanic Panic in the fairly near

1:21:49

future, and a couple of double

1:21:49

episodes and stuff like that.

1:21:52

But your feedback is always

1:21:52

welcome. As always, thank you to

1:21:56

our patrons, who helped us out

1:21:56

immensely by giving us a couple

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1:22:23

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1:22:27

notes.

1:22:31

As always, thank you

1:22:31

for listening and join us next

1:22:36

week as we add another entry

1:22:36

into this our Macabrepedia